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Added Sep 14 2017

When she was 4th Ward Alderman from 1991-2010, Alderman Joe Moore was politically aligned with Preckwinkle. I wonder what his perspective is on this assinine tax?

    Hidden treasures in Toni Taxwinkle's idiotic pop tax
    Taxpayers are rightfully angry about Toni Taxwinkle's costly and idiotic soda pop tax, though there are some hidden gems in it, too. But angry taxpayers jamming the county boardroom on Wednesday weren't looking for treasure. They were looking for vengeance on Taxwinkle for her ravenous penny-per-ounce soda pop tax.
  • Rob

    Cite some specific numbers and their sources Bruce.

  • Bruce_ Comment by TBD, whom you've muted

    The schools were built to meet a demand. Now the supply of childern has declined. The families that left cited crime, lack of services and educational opportunities as the main reasons to leave.

  • Jeffrey Littleton 3rd Generation Uptown

    Bruce is right guys. I would add taxes too.

    There is a narrative blowing around that Chicago is losing mostly low-income residents...attacking higher-income.

    Here is the rub. If they have children it is more likely than not they will move when the kids hit school-age.

    That is why there is a particular age gap in gentrified or gentrifying neighborhoods and CPS enrollment reflects this.

    There are few white teens in Uptown but very many in stroller and toddler age range. It has been like that for at least 15 years. Where are stroller kids from these tax-payers going? Suburbs.

    Then back again after college...rinse and repeat. Its been going on since the 80's in Chicago.

  • Bruce_ Comment by TBD, whom you've muted

    Looking at the CPS website it would appear that UNO uses Chicago Math where 35 new students = funding for 151 new students.
    Must be a Charter formula.
    Gale continues to perform as funding and cuts predicted. Field continues to shrink despite that new roof.

  • Rob

    Numbers Jeffrey... Come up with some.

  • Bruce isn't wrong about the decline of our grade school population. I was just disputing his claim that large numbers of families who live here are sending their kids elsewhere for school, a contention that is not supported by the numbers.

    Here are the numbers on the decline of the age 1-17 population in RP:

    1990-1995: +2,366
    1995-2000: -990
    2000-2005: -2,584
    2005-2010: -1,019

    The data is from p. 40 of this report from U. Chicago's Chapin Hall Center for Children:

  • So it looks like RP added more classroom space in response to the large increase in the early 90s, but then the increase was reversed. Helen's point about there now being too many school buildings is probably correct.

    But there are many reasons for the decline of children here. It's totally possible that a few families have left due to crime, but then why were they moving IN back when crime was significantly higher in the early 90s? I truly doubt that crime is the major factor here.

    -From 1990 to 2010 similar 0-17 declines happened in other neighborhoods with large numbers of condo conversions (which lead to an influx of younger, wealthier, childless singles and couples). Westown, Lakeview, Uptown, and the Near West Side all show a similar decline during the same period.
    -Edgewater shows a slight increase during the same period, but Edgewater has always had an even smaller 0-17 population than us. They also didn't experience the increase we did from 1990-95 (which I suspect was because of Hispanic immigration).
    -Since 1980, Chicago has lost nearly a 1/4 of its black population (a trend that has steadily continued since 2000), and Rogers Park has likely been affected by that, too.
    -There has also been a trend of Hispanic families moving to areas west of Chicago since the Great Recession, which would also affect RP's 0-17 population.
    -RP has always been a ward with a relatively LOW school-age population, which is partly due to the fact that we are the home to a large university (there are very few children living east of Clark and south of Howard, and almost none living in the SE sector near Loyola. We are among the 9 wards in Chicago with the lowest school-aged population. But Lincoln Square, West Town, Hyde Park, Edgewater, Uptown, Lake View, the Near North Side, and the Loop all have a lower percentage of the 0-17 age group than we do. These wards are also areas with the highest student population and more childless young, urban professional residents.

  • For the comparison of our 0-17 pop. group with other wards, see "Age Cohorts by Neighborhood in Chicago" on this page:

  • Bruce_ Comment by TBD, whom you've muted

    There is no incentives to move families into Rogers Park.

  • "ARE" no incentives. But that needs to be explained to the many families that do, of their own free volition, move into Rogers Park every year. Actually the comment is fake news and not at all true.

  • Speaking of incentives, another problem is that all these singles and childless couples in Rogers Park have less incentive to support local public schools. The reason public schools in the suburbs are more successful is because they have armies of parents to donate time and resources and press for effective school policies. We have relatively little of that energy in RP. Residents here DO care, in principle, but not enough to pay attention, attend meetings, donate, and get involved. In turn, that lack of attention translates to making schools less of a policy issue for officials, because what happens to Kilmer, Gale, etc., does not really sway voters at the ballot box.

  • Bruce_ Comment by TBD, whom you've muted

    The reason why the suburban schools are so successful. They have elected school boards, principles that remain in place for decades and sports.

  • Gabriel Resident of PRRP

    Preclwinkle Is like the UIC dean of the Jane Addams College of Social Work. She keeps Latinos/as out of county positions and keeps the racial binary a closed system. They need a major law suit.

  • Helen NoH North of Howard for 55 + years

    Gabriel, the president of the Cook County Board has absolutely nothing to do with most of the hiring in the county. That would be like saying Trump controls who gets hired in the national parks.

  • Helen NoH North of Howard for 55 + years

    Why should incentives be offered to familes to move to Rogers Park? That makes no sense. The apartment that was just sold in my building would have been fine for a small family, but a single man purchased it instead. Why would a family have been better?

  • Gabriel Resident of PRRP

    Helen, now you are just being silly. You might as well claim that Trump has nothing to do with health care.

  • Helen NoH North of Howard for 55 + years

    Gabriel, the fact is that he doesn't.

  • Gabriel Resident of PRRP

    Helen, you frustrate me. I know you are much more astute than you let on. One of the jobs of a state unit, department, agency or other entity of government official is to provide policy leadership. The Illinois Association of Hispanic State Employees has for years been trying to break the semi-closed patronage circle and as such was able to secure the promise of state directors to develop a plan for Latino hiring. The percentage of Latinos employed by the state is about 4% and constitutes a severe underrepresentation. Despite a few plans out there little to no progress has been made over the years.

    The same is true for city and county jobs. If one is the head, policy leadership is assumed and a course to address inequities is not something new. I think you lived through the Civil Rights era.

    I won't respond directly to you anymore because I know you as a loyalist will strain to find any excuse why nothing can be done and no one is responsible. Latinos/as have tried working through the processes allowed by the system and years later remain in the same place, only a few high profile hires with otherwise little change.

    Illinois has a strong patronage system and I know it first hand. Latinos/as need not apply is the hidden policy at many places unless one is replacing the number of Latinos/as informally allowed in the unit. I witnessed some folks be directed to one hiring location and Latinos directed out the door "Not hiring in that category."

    Why do you think Sixteen Shots Rahm gets the votes of the African American pastors , because they get cash and jobs, silly.

  • @ robinH2O
    I just got to your response about Confederate or Union ration stamps....
    That was very good!

  • Bruce_ Comment by TBD, whom you've muted

    Communities attrace families with a strong education system, thriving business districts and great leadership. Those are called amenities. RP is bleeding population. Draw your own conclusions.

  • I must live in a different RP.

  • Helen NoH North of Howard for 55 + years

    No, rogerparker, Bruce does--an RP of his imagination.

  • Bruce_ Comment by TBD, whom you've muted

    Did I imagine the private schools that shuttered operating in RP? Did I imagine the 75% of kids listed as low income?

    According to statistical atlas data 43.6% of pre-school aged childern attend private schools. 4.8% attend private highschool. Grade school 10.8% attend private schools.

    To my point. Those who can afford private choose private education.

  • This thread is about the Cook County Sweetened Beverage Tax. What's the big obsession over what percentage of parents sends their children to which school and how many are defined as coming from low income homes? Is there really a point to this non-stop obsession? It's gotten real weird with this one person's obsession popping up on all different kinds of threads no matter what the topic is. This thread is about the sweetened beverage tax and not who send their children to what school. Really weird. Somebody needs a life or a hobby.

  • Gabriel Resident of PRRP

    Yes, people choose private school in part because schools where students of color and where lower middle class kids attend are automatically coded as inferior schools while most public schools have better outcomes than charters; this even when charters are given many advantages. That is why the majority of charters run away from evaluation. For those who can afford high cost, high quality schools--better schools than the majority of us ever attended--they contribute to the resegregation of schools that is taking place across the country.

    The attack on public education is for the most part a move to privatize everything to create profit streams. It is an intentional strategy drummed up by the right wing think tanks and Friedman like economists. Its primary motivation is not quality education but greed. We play into the game chasing "quality" or religious righteousness to "protect" kids-- often out of fear. We disparage public education offhand without understanding the complexity that surrounds these issues.

    I have a critique of education but it is much more fundamental than profit streams anti-big government propaganda vs.common schools. But I am on the side of common schools in that cat fight.

  • Wazzup not available

    People choose private schools because they want their children to be educated in a respectful challenging environment - free of gang activity/mentality.

  • Bruce_ Comment by TBD, whom you've muted

    Classroom size is important.

  • How many square feet is the right size for a classroom? If it's too big the students can't see the front of the room or hear the teacher. If it's too small the desks get crowded. Excellent point Bruce. Apparently you've learned that size does matter.

  • This comment has been removed by EveryBlock staff.
  • Wasn't the lottery proceeds supposed to go for this?

  • Bruce_ Comment by TBD, whom you've muted

    Yes there is money from lottery sales to fund education. This was part of the Daley stable funding model to more corrupt volitole method in use today.

  • d3 NOH

    Isn't the lottery corrupt too ?

  • A "more corrupt volitole method"? Please explain what volitole is and provide documentation.

  • Michael Archangel Donald Trump - A compulsive liar.

    @Bruce_ - You wrote: "This was part of the Daley stable funding model to more corrupt volitole method in use today."


    First of all, what did Daley have to do with the Illinois Lottery other than Daddy Daley throwing his political support behind the initiative? The other part, "live" already asked.

  • I think he gets his massive file of cut-and-paste platitudes a tad jumbled sometimes. It's bound to happen.

  • I just ran across a site that shows how much the IL State Lottery provides to public elementary and secondary schools in the state. It's not peanuts, but it isn't a huge amount either: a total of $679 million in 2015, or around 6.5% of total state funding for schools.
    What did surprise me was the state/federal proportion of funding. I didn't realize the federal portion was so high. In 2015 we spent a total of $30 billion on elementary/secondary schools, of which IL provided $10 billion, while federal funding was $20 billion.

  • Bruce_ Comment by TBD, whom you've muted

    If the funding model was so solid why the deficit?
    Deciption the preference in Chicago funding.

  • Helen NoH North of Howard for 55 + years

    "Deciption the preference in Chicago funding."? Please explain what "deciption" is and while you're at it we're still waiting breathlessly to learn what a "volitole method" is.

  • Michael Archangel Donald Trump - A compulsive liar.

    @Bruce_ - You are conflating three issues and, in my opinion, doing it intentionally. The beverage tax is a county-wide tax. The city happens to be in the county but it is not the only municipality in the county. The lottery is a state run gambling vehicle. The city is part of the state and the county is part of the state. Despite all of these things, which you should have learned in Civics (assuming you were paying attention), it does not stop you from speaking about everything as "Chicago funding".

  • Bruce_ Comment by TBD, whom you've muted

    If it was such a great RP, City, County and state funding model then why the deficit?

    These are all connected. This is just another tax to cover another spending problem.

  • Jeffrey Littleton 3rd Generation Uptown

    Preckwinkle took over a County government in shambles and rife with cronyism.

    Preckwinkle has turned around the County health care system. Stover was a it is orderly and delivering better results.

  • Gabriel Resident of PRRP

    The county system doesn't work for Latinos/as who are excluded from jobs with the county other than at a symbolic level. Even those inside the system say she is a disaster when it comes to making jobs open to Latinos/as.

    She is a disappointment.

  • So where do you get your data from, Gabriel? I just did multiple google searches, and nothing comes up with regard to Latinos complaining about not getting hired in Cook County. I'm not contradicting you, but if this problem is as dire as you say, there should be some discussion about it somewhere online, and it doesn't show up. Can you direct me to a source?

  • Helen NoH North of Howard for 55 + years

    Aside from garbling the name of the county hospital, you're corrent, Jeffrey.

  • Helen NoH North of Howard for 55 + years


  • Gabriel, I just found a document from the Illinois Association of Hispanic Employees with some preliminary numbers. According to their 2016 state employment report (, of the 44,279 total number of Illinois state government employees in December 2016, 2,654 were Latino. That's 5.9 percent, not the 4 percent you previously reported. Still not high enough, however, given that Latinos make up 15 percent of Illinois's population. The same report lists figures for Cook County as well. According to those numbers, "Hispanics" comprised 14.7% of state employees in Cook County. That's still less than their percentage of the total Cook County population (24%), although it's considerably better than the state average.
    However, I still can't find anything specifically relating to Cook County Employees.

  • Gabriel Resident of PRRP

    Omar, we have been on the hunt for accurate state, county and city numbers for quite some time. When we find them, sometimes we find the numbers go up or down but Latinos/as are always underrepresented and often their representation is greatest at the lowest levels and a few symbolic positions toward the top.

    The Illinois Association of Hispanic State Employees has done a good job and this was with inqueries established early on by past State Senator Del Valle who had the courage to demand the figures be readily available and something be done to address this problem.

    But it is still a struggle.As one alderman stated when he pressed the issue of equitable city employment, he was told to"step back" on this issue.

    Corrupt Sixteen shots Rahm HighSpanic alderman settle for a few symbolic hires at the upper end then genuflect.

    It is a maddening problem that is mostly whispered among LatinX folks in corridors but it occasionally bubbles up. Many are afraid to go public with the issue given repercussions and fear of igniting tensions between ethnic/racial groups.

    The county is no different and no serious efforts have been initiated to address the problem.

  • Gabriel Resident of PRRP

    Pew lists the following:

    The Hispanic population in Illinois is the fifth largest in the nation. About 2.2 million Hispanics reside in Illinois, 4% of all Hispanics in the United States.

    Illinois’ population is 17% Hispanic, the 10th largest Hispanic statewide population share nationally.

  • Perceptions and impressions are certainly not invalid--they can point to real problems, although in the case of employment percentages, you ultimately have to have real numbers in order to have any impact.

    I wonder why it is that Cook County doesn't seem to provide a breakdown on who it hires. I have to say, that murkiness alone gives your perspective some credence.

    Chicago does a slightly better job, apparently, although Latino city employees are still far behind their share of the city's population. I don't know what the situation is like in 2017, but these are the stats from 2015:

    "Of the more than 32,500 total city employees, nearly 46 percent are white, 31.8 percent are black, 18 percent are Hispanic and fewer than 3 percent are Asian American." (Compared to a city that is roughty 30% white, 30% Latino and 30% Black).

    In any case, it seems like just about every governmental office in the state has much better representation by whites (strongly overrepresented) and blacks (who achieve parity to their population in many Chicago--and likely Cook Cty--government offices), and Latinos are still pretty far behind as the "newcomers." But if you're going to blame Preckwinkle for low Latino hiring in Cook County, you have to blame every single other government entity in the state as well.

  • Gabriel Resident of PRRP

    Omar, yes I do place blame on every single government entity and their leaders starting with Rauner, including Preckwinkle, and ending with 16Shots Rahm.

    The underepresentation of LatinX groups has been ongoing and well known to LatinX policy advocates. Preckwinkle was a disappointment because people had hopes that she was cut from a different cloth. That turned out to be limited differences with Emanuel but not a reformer when it came to LatinX underrepresentation.

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