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Added Apr 19 2012

So, I am curious to hear what people are thinking about the Red Light Cameras going up?

Personally I think they are a safety hazard and a money grab.

I have had the flash on Western and Touhy go off in my face late at night and ruin my night vision because someone got too close to the white line. I have had people slam on their brakes in front of me because the light turned yellow. They are a definite safety hazard.

The money grab part is just blatently obvious. Some one else brought ut that it is also a ploy to becin phasing out the crossing guards, who all cost money.

Speed Bumps are cheap and very effective why arent we using something that doesnt tax the citizens? Why does the city punish the good hard working people of the community. Why focus on someone going 10 mph ofer the speed limit when we have kids shooting each other i nthe street?

This is so obviously a money grab!

So, lets add a solution. What would work to counter this? A petition drive? Media Campaign? How do we get these lame politicians to realize that they represent the people and that the people of this city are tired of their Orwellian tactics?

  • Definite money grab veiled under the charade that these cameras help save lives. The only way to get them removed, that I see, would be to vote out the people who supported their installation. That would take a very concerted effort on the people to dismantle the Democratic Machine. But even then, I've learned that a politician is very reluctant to loosen their grip on any tax money that comes into their grubby mitts.

    As we've seen with the new Speed Camera Law getting passed here, these politicians will reject studies that refute their claims of safety. Besides, there is no money to grab if they attempt to stop the shooting happening every day in this city.

  • I agree with the money grab part of it, but that's in the contract, not the implementation. I disagree with the safety hazard part of it. The flash is not so bright that it impairs vision, unless there is an underlying issue already with your eyes, like cataracts. Speed Bumps don't stop people from running red lights. Red light runners endanger everyone, and increase traffic jams and accidents.

    These cameras don't tax citizens, they fine law breakers. I hope the city can do more than one thing at a time. I hope they can work to fight violence and traffic dangers. I don't want them to wait until all violent acts are stopped before working on the safety of people walking, cycling and driving.

  • Cecilia Morales Mom, entrepeneur and yoga teacher

    I agree it's a big waste of money (maintenance to cameras, I also have been glared by the flashes at night even when I am not that close to the camera, etc) and it defers money from other important REAL safety hazards like guns in our neighborhood. I am surprised the citizens didn't react like they did with the parking meters (which we still got stuck with). But not sure what can be done to stop them. It seems the City keeps doing whatever they want and the people just have to take it which is sad :( But I am not familiar with the process necessary to help vote against these things.

  • It's also the MAN watching us everywhere we go. Part of the agenda

  • People who run red lights are a REAL Safety hazard. More people die from car accidents than firearms. Plus, it's not an either/or proposition. The city deals with snow plowing and restaurant inspections. Those two have nothing to do with each other either.

  • Bruce Mayberry, Roger Parkansas

    Wow I did not hear about the 119 people that died in Auto accidents this year in Chicago this year. I did read about how Chicago ended the first quarter of 2012 with 118 homicides.

  • Are you talking about the red light cameras in school zones? If so, I think they are a great idea. Otherwise, where are new ones slated to go up in "the neighborhood"?

  • Bruce Mayberry, Roger Parkansas

    According to the Department of Public Health Trauma Registry, only 27 children were killed in traffic accidents between 2008 and 2010.

    While 129 children under 16 were killed in homicides over the same time period.
    HMM how much bang for the buck?

  • Bruce Mayberry, Roger Parkansas

    According to NHTSA data, there were 927 fatalities on Illinois roads in 2010.

  • Traffic collisions 43,000 1.8%
    Firearms deaths 29,000 1.2% Suicide: 16,586; homicide: 10,801; Accidents: 776; Legal intervention: 270; Unknown: 230

    http://proxy.baremetal.com/csdp.org/research/1238.pdf

    But again I point out: WHY are these in the same conversation? Why can't we find people who run red lights to be dangerous, without comparing them to a totally separate issue?

    Health issues related to being overweight kill more people than guns & cars combined. maybe we should talk about Trans Fats and how they relate to red light cameras, too.

  • to bruce. you must not have children, because 27 children are 27 too many. 1 is too many.

  • @Rebecca

    You are using National statistics, not Chicago statistics. In Chicago there appears to be more people dying from gun violence than there are people that get hit by a car. I don't have the numbers, just basing it on what I see on the news and read in the papers. Yet, the city is finding more ways to steal money from its citizens with these cameras in the name of safety when statistics have shown that these new cameras will save marginally less lives than what the Mayor is touting.

  • IL stats show the same thing, just not in as easy a way to quote. Your observations of the news have no bearing on actual statistics. More people die of being overweight than guns, but that's not on the news. The news reports exciting things, and car accidents aren't exciting. Mainly because they're really, really common.

    Again, they are two different conversations. Why must every topic on this site be about guns? I understand guns are dangerous, but they don't have a place in EVERY conversation.

    http://www.cityofchicago.org/content/dam/city/depts/cdph/statistics_and_reports/SR_leading%20causes%20of%20death%202006.pdf

    Page 39---Homocide is responsible for fewer Chicago deaths than most other causes, including accidents. It's not even top 10 for most demographics.

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    It is really hard to believe that the city has some people actually believeing that they are a benefit to safety.

    So....I guess the Speed Bump is just ancient technology (that nets no revenue)

    and yes, my eyes are fine, but late at night, when you have been driving for a while and you are looking in the direction of the camera, it messes with your night vision. (but if yo uwere never i nthe military i dont expect you to know what "night vision" means in the way i am talking about)

    Unfortunately thisis one of those topics where people will always be divided and those that toss statictics around that they pull off the web somewhere dont see the smaller picture. So, how many kids, in chicago, have been hit by a speeder in a school zone?

    Can I see that number? (sorry, 1 is too many really doesnt justify it) if that is the case, you have to ban everything that ever hurt a child that is in existance.

    Im just saying, you cant refute the idea that this is all about fiscal gain and nothing else.

  • Bill, are you talking about speed cameras or red light cameras? They are two separate things. Speed Bumps won't do anything about running red lights, which is what I've been discussing. Mainly I've been pointing out that guns and gun violence have NOTHING to do with any conversation about traffic safety and enforcement.

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    both. I am against both. the red light cams are a done deal and not much can be done about them. The speed cams we can still fight

  • The Red Light cameras should ticket cyclists as well. I've come close to hitting more cyclists running red lights while I have the green than I've ever come close to hitting a pedestrian.

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    oh yes! I agree to that!

  • Cecilia Morales Mom, entrepeneur and yoga teacher

    Wow didn't mean to spark anger of any kind by using the word "REAL" but I didn't think school zone/park area speeding cameras were so critical to safety. So yes, I was personally referring to school zone cameras where you will be ticketed if you go 6 miles over the speed limit or more. Red light cameras I am fine with but I do wish they used night vision photography to avoid the flashes as how it affects your vision depends on which direction you are looking and if you happen to be looking at the wrong spot it does make a difference (I also have had lasik eye surgery which causes more night "halos" around lights so this exacerbates anyone who has had lasik). I agree for school zones speed bumps have always been a great solution and in this particular case it feels to me personally, like an opportunity to get more cash to a broken system that doesn't know how to balance itself. I am also wondering if they will have cameras on LSD as it technically runs along grant park, so if you go 6 miles over you would get a ticket. And yes I agree cyclists should be also required to obey the traffic laws I have had risky situations come up with them both as a pedestrian and as a driver. I guess the city has to make money somehow.

  • Inactive user

    The Red Light Cameras are a Shake-Down Racket. Organized crime no longer operates in the shadows they are the government and the corporations and bankers that own them.

  • for all of these traffic issues, go to this website: www.theexpiredmeter.com

    Many of the red light cameras are timed to have yellow lights less than 3 minutes, which is what is required by law. This guarantees a steady stream of revenue on every rotation because some cars will not have time to clear the intersection. One such traffic expert is www.theticketdoctor.com He did studies at various intersections and discovered the red light intersections that generated by far the most revenue had these "shorted" yellow lights

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    yes, both of those site, I have visited in the past and have great info! I am looking into the products that mask your plate from teh camera, but I have to research the legality of them. Or, we can just do like the Chicago Police and use clean nail polish on the plate to keep the cameras from seeing them! LOL

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    "Speed cameras are a great idea if you want to increase traffic times. Local spokesperson for the National Motorists Association and traffic safety expert Barnet Fagel believes speed cameras will cause drivers to suddenly slow down through the camera enforced safety zones, but then speed up after leaving the zone causing traffic dislocation and longer commute times.

    “Speed cameras will slow traffic flow,” says Fagel. “You think traffic is bad now? Just wait until the speed cameras go in then prepare to be stuck in traffic even longer.”"

    quote from theexpiredmeter.com

  • does the nail polish work? did you mean CLEAR nail polish?

  • This is not based on a need, as all laws should be, it is based on revenue. Laws should be created when there is an abundance of a problem. DUI laws were created when there were multiple traffic accidents from driving under the influence of drugs or alcohol. A red light camera/speed camera will not be a deterrent as these are simply reactionary and impose a penalty after the act has already been committed. Playing on people's fear "SAVE THE CHILDREN" is a common theme that no individual who wants to get re-elected would go against. As was shown though, the City of Chicago was unable to produce statistics of children that were injured or killed in school zones or parks by SPEEDING cars. Also, what kids are in parks from 7am-7pm when they are supposed to be in school? Not to mention, what about summers? Well at least the majority should be in school until around 4pm. Again, laws should be create based on true stats/need, not created by fear or by a crystal ball. Now in no way hoping that any one child is hurt just as much as I hope that no adult is either. Why be reactive and not proactive. Speed bumps and traffic circles are a deterrent. Cameras will not stop speeders. I have the perfect example. A few months ago a stolen vehicle was running from the police, it cut through a neighborhood and hit a traffic circle and then a parked car. Two blocks in from a main road. What would a speed camera have done to save a person (a child) walking in the street at that moment or any moment like that? Not a single thing. But what it did do was stop a speeding vehicle. Same thing it can do to a non-stolen speeding vehicle. Guess what, statistically there are a lot more stolen vehicles in Chicago than pedestrians hit by a car. People need to see this for what it is - Legislation that was pushed through Springfield by the City of Chicago and no other municipalities. I applaud Osterman and the other 12 for voting NO on this.

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    I agree. But our Alderman voted a big resounding YES on it. I emailed him a few times letting him know I opposed it.

    Guess who isnt getting my vote next time around. We have to elect people that actually represent their constituents and not the coffers.

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    Id like to see if there are any online petitions or something floating around to sign, just to make a statement. I know that petitions mean nothing now-a-days unless a fat campaign contribution is attached to it. Still, it is a statement

    Remember, long ago a statement

    Taxation without representation?

    the so called lawmakers have forgotten, they work for us, the citizens. By the people, for the people. dust off the history books.

  • daveP been around awhile

    It's total crap. I also emailed our beloved alderman about opposition to the cameras, so he'll not be getting my vote again either. New mayor, same rubber stamps.

    I love how the mayors office provided bogus stats when they weren't busy stonewalling the requests.

    Check out a book called "The science of fear"
    It's pretty interesting.

  • Helen North of Howard for 50 + years

    Bill, why didn't you title your post correctly? The ordinance that passed yesterday was for speed cameras. Since my companion and I don't speed, these cameras shouldn't affect us at all. Speed humps, on the other hand, affect everyone that has to pass over them. They're jarring, even at 10 mph, and we hate them. I'd be fine with putting in speed cameras around our local school and removing the humps.

    Also Bill, isn't your threat to not vote for Ald. Moore the next time around a rather hollow one? Last December, in response to the new map of the 49th Ward, you wrote: "This map puts me back in the 50th again."

  • BILL, THE STATEMENT IS "NO" TAXATION WITHOUT REPRESENTATION

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    in todays World it is Taxation without representation. We are being taxed and those that represent us, really dont.

  • Inactive user

    I agree with Helen...if you aren't speeding, you don't have to worry about getting a ticket. I personally don't care if they have speed cameras placed....if I don't speed, I won't get a ticket. As far as photo enforced red lights....if you are approaching an intersection & the "don't walk" signal is blinking....the light is about to turn yellow....many lights count down in seconds before they turn yellow. If I am in traffic, the determining factor for me stopping at a yellow light is how fast someone is coming up behind me. Considering most people think a yellow light means to hit the gas, I would rather take the chance of a ticket than getting rear-ended. & sorry, I just don't believe that any elected official cares about me...the public. Politics is a game...it has little to do with the people represented.

  • Is it not possible to have more than one motivation in passing a piece of legislation? Is it so wrong for a law to raise both revenue for the city (which could very potentially go to better fund the CPD to help fight the gun violence) AND to try and punish and catch those breaking the law and endangering their fellow citizens?

    I await your thanks for finally putting this speed/red light camera debate to rest and bringing both sides together. I'm just a uniter like that.

  • want to bet the speed cameras will be rigged just like the red light cameras are rigged to bring in more revenue?

  • Brian F Long time resident of chicago

    spend half of your time staring at your spedo to make sure you arent over 35 mph and youre likely to get into an accident.

    If these red light cameras were for safety, we would have yellow lights that had counters on them (they can afford this in places like Cambodia for goodness sake) so you arent guessing on the length of the yellow. Its for money just like street cleaning which doesnt seem to clean up very much but sure writes a lot of tickets.

  • HELEN and VICTORIA, You seem to be the exact indivdiuals who believe that creating gun laws keeps them out of the hands of criminals. Right, because criminals buy guns legally when they commit their crimes. Going back to the topic, if you don't speed you won't get a ticket. The whole point of the law being created was to PREVENT speeding to protect our children. The cameras do nothing to curb this. No one is saying that someone shouldn't be punished for going over significantly. The whole point is that this was disguised as a 'save the children' when it really has nothing to do with it based on the lack of statistics given by the City of Chicago of children injured in school zones or by parks by SPEEDING. There are statistics around pedestrian accidents in these zones, but look at the real statistics and break it down to the point of the law --- speeding causing injuries to children around parks and in school zones. Remember that the overall statistics would include those texting, looking at the bird in the sky, or any other distraction. Be able to show the exact statistic for the exact reason of the law. I can also bet you that speed bumps help focus a driver from distractions and curb speeding better than a traffic camera can. It forces you to watch the road in front of you and also make you slow down. Why don't they use them to put points on a Driver's License making them a State infraction rather than an Administrative Ticket through the City of Chicago, Department of REVENUE. That will curb habits better than a fine. How many people get meter tickets over and over again. It's the same thing at a higher penalty. So if you continue to think that the laws are created out of necessity for safety and not financial, well then please don't vote.

  • Helen North of Howard for 50 + years

    Brian wrote: "spend half of your time staring at your spedo to make sure you arent over 35 mph and youre likely to get into an accident." Good Grief, no wonder you don't want speed cameras. Suggest you study the Rules of the Road again, Brian. The speed limit in a School Zone is 20 mph; I can see the sign now out my window. Guess you don't move your car on street cleaning days either. When the cars are moved, the streets get cleaned. I wish they'd tow cars that don't move.

  • I asked our Alderman a series of questions. He answered NONE. He was then asked to provide any information he had in support of this ordinance, again he provided NONE. The questions asked follow.

    Dear Alderman Moore,  could your office please answer a few questions regarding the school speed zone cameras please.

    What are the statistics for the years 2010 and 2011 for the 49th ward/24th district
    1. How many traffic accidents involving children with injuries in school zones were reported?
    2. What was the day of the week and time of these accidents?
    3. How many speeding in school zone citations were issued by officers in the 24th district?
    4. How many citations were issued by officers in the 24th district to any speeders for any violations under 10 miles per hour over the posted speed limit?
    5. How many complaints has your office received of speeding violations in school zones during school hours?
    6. What was the action taken on these complaints and what were the results?

  • Brian F Long time resident of chicago

    Helen, the problem is that the law is covers 80% of the city which is within a few blocks of a school or park. Almost all of western ave is within the speeding camera zone. Next time you are on western, take a look at your speedometer, its hard to even notice when you are going 36 vs 32. If it were just in front of schools, I would have no problem with that, they are easy to see and identify and I naturally slow down in those areas especially when I see children playing, tho speed bumps would still be more effective.

  • John,

    When did you ask the questions?

    Were they in writing or in person?

    I just want to make sure you didn't just send him an e-mail 10 minutes ago

  • The questions were emailed to the Alderman on March 29th, 7:40 pm. I have all the correspondence between me and his office and the ward committeeman. Interesting, eyeopening, you should read it.

  • someone please fill me in on what passed yesterday. isn't it only for when you are in a "school zone" and during school hours?

  • Cecilia Morales Mom, entrepeneur and yoga teacher

    "The automated cameras will enforce speed zones from 7 a.m. to 7 p.m. in school zones and approximately 6 a.m. to 11 p.m. in parks."

    The good news is that you gt warnings the first 2 times:
    http://news.medill.northwestern.edu/chicago/news.aspx?id=204371

    You get charger $35 for going 6 miles to 10 miles over the limit and it increases form there. The speed you must stay at in these areas is 20 miles an hour.

  • John,

    Interesting. I'd prefer statistics too.

  • The only reason they are a safety concern is because of speeding. If cruising and braking properly, everyone should be able to manage observing a red light. I don't care if they are a money grab, they will save life and limb, and the grab is easily avoided. I approve of them.

  • Matt T that is the whole point if any alderman or the Mayor himself had any supporting statistics, data or studies believe me they would be published and everyone would know it.

  • Inactive user

    It's ironic how the Blue-Light Cams never seem to work when they are needed, anybody want to bet the Red-Light Cams will even when they are not.

  • Inactive user

    I am against ALL cameras that 'watch' the public PEROID

  • Inactive user

    Me too John, I was just trying to point out what an obvious racket this is.

  • I have lived in Rogers Park for 63, years now we are going to get speed cameras. We will only recieve a few. Who and how are the powers that be going to decide where they are going to be located? Based on what!!? One would assume they would be placed in the most problematic location. What location is that? What is the most dangerous school or park in the Ward? I have not read one statement from anyone on where the very first camera should be placed. What school or park has that serious of a problem? Then the next question is, what are the police doing about it now?

  • Cecilia Morales Mom, entrepeneur and yoga teacher

    I actually think cameras can sometimes aid in other areas like how they have helped identify serious criminals in the UK, but all that is personal preference, we all are entitled to our own. I just don't agree with the philosophy of the charade: telling us this is needed because it's a big problem then not providing numbers or facts making it feel like it really is about this being an easy stream of revenue. I think the group concern of those that want facts behind this decision is that we are seeing the city come up with more and more ways to collect revenue (higher paid stickers for SUVs, parking meter increases and now these camera tickets) whilst not addressing the poor management of their budget. It ends up feeling a bit dishonest and like the more they collect the bigger the black hole gets. As an economist on a radio show put it: "Chicago is the Greece of the US". I don't think there is anything wrong with people questioning these decisions and wanting facts. If some people are super happy to have sped cameras that's wonderful but I don't think we should condemn others for questioning. It's the one important value that we should be instilling in our children, fiends and neighbors. Don't just roll over and take all decisions from the institutions or government as the right thing. It's alright to do our due diligence, research and question. What is wrong with questioning? That's how we got to a place where insurance companies run our healthcare and our laws now favor corporations over individuals. If you guys find facts and numbers that support/refute this decision please share. We should be thankful we live in a country where we can have different points of view and take advantage to learn form each other.

  • Brian F Long time resident of chicago

    Emanuel lobbied hard for the bill, which he said will save lives. But statistical evidence for that claim is weak. Of Chicago’s 251 pedestrian fatalities between 2005 and 2009, the Tribune reported fewer than half occurred in the “safety zones” designated for speed cameras, and fewer than half of those involved speeding. Of course, that doesn’t say anything about reducing serious injuries, just fatalities.

  • Hey if the cameras can raise some revenue that can be used for things like policing and at the same time convince some idiot not to speed through a school zone, I'd say it'd be a success.

  • Carl G. Rogers Park resident

    Something tells me the speed cams will rarely malfunction, unlike the blue light safety cams. Question of city priorities.

    City Council knew that enough people would swallow the "safety" justification that the measure would meet with little effective opposition. Voters will accept any law that has the phase "save lives" in it, even if requires a multi-million dollar technological apparatus and a more tense and nervous driving experience for millions in order to save the lives of very few. (The figure of 35 school-zone pedestrian deaths being bandied around in this discussion isn't true: there were only 18 pedestrian fatalities in all of Cook County in 2010, according to Illinois State Police records, so the number in school zones would be considerably lower than that.)

    Meanwhile, Gov. Quinn announced today that thousands of Illinois families will have basic Medicare and health care assistance taken away from them, which will lead to many more deaths. No one talks about saving lives when cost-cutting is involved. The city and state will save lives when there's a lucrative return, but to hell with the unfortunate when there isn't.

  • Carl,

    I think the disservice that's being done is the lack of statistics being offered on the number of injuries and a clarification on the number of fatalities, as well as the cost of the technology. As I noted above, it is certainly possible for the ordinance to be designed to both raise revenue AND improve safety.

    Then you bring up a totally unrelated state issue, and you lost me.

  • Brian F Long time resident of chicago

    lets be clear, these arent going in school zones, they are going in an area wihtin 1/8 mile of a school or park. Thats pretty much everywhere. We are going to pay to put them there, then pay fines for driving down western ave at 36 mph.

    here is a map of the covered areas. zoom in. My house is covered and I dont have any schools on my street. http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=208718888081149251664.0004b859727779fdc1fcb&msa=0

  • Brian,

    I honestly don't know as I can't recall, what is the speed limit on Western? Because if it's 35 your fine. If it's 36 you're speeding, and would have no real right to complain if the police pulled you over. I'm not sure why it's an added burden,

  • Cecilia Morales Mom, entrepeneur and yoga teacher

    Matt T re: revenue

    "Illinois state law requires that all revenue from the cameras be filtered back into child safety programs."

    Per the same article I posted before. And maybe Child Safety programs are an area where we really are underfunded -- I am unaware. But I would love to see reports of where this money goes once it is in the system. Just think its a right we should have.

  • Brian F Long time resident of chicago

    fyi, all city streets are 30mph except school zones which are 20 and lsd which changes between 40 in winter and 45 in summer. Take a look at your speed next time you are driving down western ave, you are likely to find you are going more than 30mph unless its one of the countless hours you might spend in stopped traffic.

  • @Cecilia: I don't know the specific, but would funding for the police count as "child safety". Either way, money is fungible so money from the speed cameras can free up money elsewhere.

    @Brian: I've never really had a problem with keeping it within 5mph of the speed limit to be honest. I simply can't afford a traffic ticket, so I'm careful, which is I think what they're going for with the cameras

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    Because 1 mph is make or break. Your speedometer and the radar on the cam are not calibrated. They will be diffrrent. Your car says 34 mph the cam say 37. Who will the department of revenue believe?

  • Which is no different that Police radar guns.

  • Carl G. Rogers Park resident

    Totally unrelated, Matt? I don't think so. The speed cams had to be approved at the state level, and the same logic is being followed at city and state and even national levels. Speed cams on interstates will be next; airborn drones are already patrolling the nation's skies. And Rahm is cutting aid to the underprivileged just like Quinn is doing. All this is broader than a city issue.

  • "Rahm is cutting aid to the underprivileged just like Quinn is doing."

    so... the solution would be to raise revenue...right?

  • Brian F. Thanks for your comments about speed limits, for the most part you are correct, without a posted speed limit 30 mph. However in Rogers Park there are several streets with posted 25 mph speed limits. One example is Pratt between Western and Ridge. .

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    At least with the Radar gun, there is a Cop behind it that can say, "eh, it's only 1 mph over, ill give him a pass" Big Brother wont do that, it will just whip out that ticket and mail it off to you.

  • So you object to a fair and consistent application of the law?

  • Kathryn S. Happy Resident

    Totally agree about the money grab and the safety hazard. Who can afford $100 for a ticket? Not me, so we slam on the brakes at yellow lights. Plus; while I'm driving, it effects my concentration. I'm so worried about racking up tickets that it makes me a nervous and skiddish driver. Especially when it's raining! These things are awful.

  • Let me bluntly say that Red Light Cameras are not safe and will never be. It’s like saying that the disclaimer on cigarette packets will prevent smoking, it does not.

    Anna Goral ran for Alderman in the last election and put out a lot of literature claiming she would totally disallow red light cameras in her ward. She even stated that the red light camera would “most likely” take a turn for the worst and ticket people for going 5miles over the speed limit. These camera’s cost hundreds of thousands of dollars to install and operate, are you not paying enough in taxes?

    I understand that people have safety concerns, I do to. This is why we have local law enforcement. I want my tax dollars going to the families of local law enforcement. Not machines that just terrify drivers because if drives are a second too slow, they will be slapped with an overly expensive ticket and have no right to contest the ticket.

  • Inactive user

    All of the revenue generated from this Mega-Scam will be handed out to criminals in the form of nonsensical and overpriced contracts.
    None of it will go back to the people of Chicago in any tangible way.

    Rahm 9-fingers is having a good laugh right about now.
    You guys should have spoken out when there was still time!

  • Carl G. Rogers Park resident

    The broader logic going on with the traffic/speed cam issue is also the increasing control and surveillance of individual drivers generally. Insurance companies are just starting to introduce the concept of the "black box" that will monitor every driver's safety and then price the insurance accordingly. It's not obligatory, but they lure you in with the promise of cheaper rates for safe driving, and eventually it becomes unaffordable not to accept the black box. It's similar to the way health insurance programs are increasingly requiring individual monitoring. Ezra Klein has a feature on this topic in today's Wonkbook:

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/ezra-klein/post/the-all-knowing-insurance-company/2012/04/20/gIQAUmChVT_blog.html#excerpt

  • Another suggestion is to drive so safely that the camera won't generate revenue. I've read somewhere that each camera costs about $1500 or more to maintain and if it doesn't generate enough traffic, it may be moved to another intersection

  • Brian F, Matt T, Maciek on Jarvis. Please the next time you guys are driving in the neighborhood I would encourage each of you to travel south on Western Ave. to the intersection of Jarvis Ave. Look to the pole on the southwest corner of the intersection and you will observe a School Zone 20 mph sign. As you continue south on Western Ave. you will find no end of school zone sign ( at least as far as Touhy Ave.). This sign applies for south bound traffic on Western Ave.

    Next you can travel north bound on Western Ave. from Touhy Ave. on a pole in front of 7311 Western Ave. Here you will observe another School Zone 20 mph sign. As you continue to Howard St. you will not observe an end of school zone sign.

    I am not that familiar with the current City ordiances or the State Statutes on these postings, possibly the 20 mph zone is only in effect for one block of the posting.

    I am only pointing this out as one example in our neighborhood of the possible confusion reference this program. I am sure other neighbors can point to other locations.

    Anyway I guess that is why if our neighbors and or elected officials can't answer our questions the City has given us the Hearing Officer program so he/ she can explain the ordinance/ law just before they find us liable and order us to pay the appropriate fine.

  • All of you neighbors on EB, please keep this in mind, that our dear leader is well known (from his days in Washington) for using P.R. firms/media strategists to influence public opinion. That means hiring such firms who have rooms full of employees trolling sites such as this one every day and posting comments, which is why they are called "influencers". Just sayin. . .

  • Inactive user

    @Nolan

    That's obvious, look at the guys posting that are pro-cam they don't even know the speed limit in Chicago.

  • Yep, you know me... pure shill.

    Though please, keep up the paranoid conspiracy stuff... it's the reason I started posting here in the 1st place. I'm still waiting for the diatribe connecting the JFK assassination, the Masons, and Bin Laden's burial at see.

    Bonus points Chris if you can connect those to either "what really happened on 9/11" or "the President's birth certificate"

    Super bonus points if you can even reach alien conspiracy.

  • as a side note, I wish I did get paid to troll you guys...

  • wow: "burial at see" that'll teach me to attempt English before I've had coffee

  • Public relations people are the ones who give us ______ and tell us it smells good. Their reputation is so bad, they changed their name to "media strategists". Typical P.R. stunt: wreck your image? Just change your name.

  • Inactive user

    LOL! How's the old melon? Natural Ice is really bad beer.

  • Inactive user

    @Nolan

    I'd be happy if these guys just changed their beer for starters!

  • http://chicagotonight.wttw.com/comment/4666

    Letter to Governor Quinn;
    Dear Governor Quinn,

    This communication points out notable facts about Illinois’ financial love affair red light cameras.

    · Chicago has more (387) red light cameras than any other city in North America!
    · Chicago fined motorists over $65 Million in 2009 for just red light camera violations, more than any other U.S. city!
    · Chicago has distinguished itself as the only city to purchase a red light camera system rather than lease from a camera system vendor, a large capital expenditure.
    · Chicago signed a $50M five-year camera service contract with Redflex!
    · Ch
    · Chicago’s camera-equipped traffic signal intersections do not comply with Illinois Traffic Safety Memorandum 2-07 red light camera safety specifications due to home rule provisions!
    · Suburban and out of area drivers traveling to Chicago on surface streets are greeted with traffic signals with fleeting yellow lights at least one second shorter, usurping motorists out of 44 feet of stopping distance (dilemma zone) at 30 MPH at each intersection! This causes deviously dangerous traffic disruptions shown to increase rear-end crashes and injuries.
    · Independent forensic video analysis has positively proven at least a hundred or more of Chicago’s red light camera equipped intersections’ traffic signals consistently display less than the three second Federal minimum steady yellow signal

    Respectfully,

    Barnet Fagel

  • To Matt T re 35 is ok on Western: I don't think you understand. Going 35 on Western will now be 15 over the "school zone" 20 MPH and subject to a $100 fine.

  • So speeding in a school zone during school hours when the 20 MPH speedlimit is in place gets you a fine? I'm shocked. Literally, shocked.

  • Inactive user

    Soon Rahm is going to be the most despised man in Chicago

  • Gotta get the speed cameras installed so our misleader can use that revenue to pay off the payday-type loans he is arranging in his so-called "infrastructure trust", a scheme to hide his wheeler-dealing from the taxpayers under layers and layers of the 'fox watching the henhouse' appointees, appointed by the misleader himself. Infrastructure projects should be funded by issuing municipal bonds subject to Freedom of Information Act requests. If you liked the parking meter deal, you're going to love the "infrastructure trust". Another page out of the T.I.F. playbook: empty the treasury, and then think up new schemes to gouge the taxpayers

  • Enjoy all! You voted for this......

  • Carl G. Rogers Park resident

    Not many Chicagoans were paying attention when the speed cams were proposed and debated several months ago--that would have been the time to have an opinion. Too late now. Get your heads out of the sand, people, and pay attention to what's going on in your city hall. Try having an opinion when it will actually have an effect.

  • when i first heard about this, all i read about was "school zones" and i thought that was fine. when did they add the parks?

  • Inactive user

    @Carl G. - I would bet the farm that it wouldn't matter to Rahm and company. His lobbyists are getting the contracts for installing the cameras. Its obvious he could care less of what his constituents think. This decision was made before he even got elected.

  • As long as there is a countdown timer on the crosswalk signal, I don't have a problem with it. It is those intersections without countdown timers that are ridiculous. You have no idea when it is going to turn yellow and give you ticket. If I got a ticket from one of those, I would fight it in court. They can't make you use your psychic powers on red light timing.

  • Carl G. Rogers Park resident

    Matt, that's a defeatist attitude, don't you think? Rahm et al are counting on you thinking that way. ("No one will listen to us anyway, so I'll let them do whatever they want with my money and my future.") But when many individuals express their political opinions on a given subject, those opinions have the potential to unexpectedly coalesce and have an effect.

  • 92 comments on red Light Cameras? follow the rules of the road.

  • Inactive user

    Amen! This also goes for bikers as well.

  • Inactive user

    C'mon guys, we can get this to 100 comments! Me, I say put up Green Light Cameras, and ticket anyone who stops illegally.

  • @bill savage...hahahahaha

  • KMQ Firmly entrenched in Rogers' Park

    Its a really sad world when we're spodding just to put this to 100 comments. And yet, I have fallen in with the herd. I just hope that comment #100 is EveryBlock Sarah or Becca telling us to keep it on topic. I love our EB Overlords. :)

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    Notice how our Alderman has avoided this roll of comments like the plague?

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    @ Matt....would you like a ditribe about Masons? Im one and I dont have the power of the NWO to influence Rahm and his Cronies.

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    @Nolan.....yeah, that trust is another topic worthy of 100 plus comments!

  • @Bill

    what you don't even have any influence over Rahm with all or your (puts sunglasses on) National Treasure

    YYYEEEAAAAHHH!!!!

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    anyone interested in signing a petition to ban the cams?

    http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/ban-the-cams-ward49/

  • Steve G. SW Burbs to far NorthSide and everywere between

    A car rear-ended me on Lincoln and Touhy becaues the woman in front of me slammed on her breaks and stopped on a yellow light that was a red light cam. They are a hazard especialy for motorcyclists.

  • Inactive user

    Isn't it too late for a petition?

  • Helen North of Howard for 50 + years

    Matt, it was probably always too late for a petition. Some folks, it seems, like to promote lost causes.

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    It is never too late for a citizen to voice an opinion. There are just some people that give up too easily and that is why we put up with these situations. You can put up a fight or roll over and give them your belly thinking it is a lost couse. your choice, I choose to fight. I guess 8 years in the Marines gave me that ability. I didnt fight to roll over.

  • Inactive user

    It's never too late other places have done away with these Mafia-Shake-Down Cams. Chicago will be harder but it could be done!

  • Bill W., Count me in--I hate feeling like I live in a police state. And if we can't get rid of them city-wide we can probably get rid on them here in the 'hood, by impressing on our Aldermen how much we object to them.

  • Red light cameras and speed cameras are an excellent source of revenue by punishing those who break the law and reducing the financial burden upon law-abiding citizens. It is simple slow down, be courteous, be defensive and obey the law and you will not have any issues with traffic cameras.

  • Brian F Long time resident of chicago

    but the city told us that the red light cameras and speed cameras are for safety not revenue! ;)

    Report back when you get your first speeding ticket for a poorly marked school zone. If the city made it fair, such as putting count down timers above the stop lights, then they wouldnt make any money but it would be fair, reasonable and safer... but we all know thats doesnt seem to be happening. Ive never gottan a red light ticket but I expect that everyone in the city will get several speeding tickets, does that mean we all drive way to fast? I'm just waiting for the day that everyone in favor of this theft on the citizens of chicago gets robbed themselves and changes their tone.

  • They are for safety AND revenue. don't fool yourselves. I guess i have been lucky. I drive 400 miles a week for work and have never gotten a ticket. Maybe i drive too safe.

  • and when i do get a ticket. its probably cuz i did something wrong.

  • Inactive user

    Most school zones state that the 20mph is during school hours when children are present. I don't get what is so difficult about that. Several years ago, I got a ticket for speeding in a school zone...my normal work schedule was such that I was not driving during the times that warrented the school speed limit. Taught me a lesson...haven't gotten one since. Maybe anyone that gets "caught" will learn the same lesson that I learned. Speed limits/laws have a purpose. It's not a time for a person to decided whether or not they agree with the posted limit.

  • But Mike, you first said you never got a ticket....but then you said, if I did I deserved it - which is it?

  • Ok, IF i ever DO get a ticket . Its cuz i DO something wrong. LOL Good Lord......

  • Brian F Long time resident of chicago

    many people in chicago only make $100 a day. People should be punished when they choose to make bad decisions. Following the flow of traffic is not a choice. I sat at western and addison for a bit today. Not a child in sight and every car that past was driving a causal 30-35 mph. I didnt feel that any of them were unsafe, being jerks or otherwise causing a problem. Every one of them would get a ticket after july 1. Many of these people dont make $108,000 like an alderman or $170,000 plus kickbacks like the mayors office, and the punishment is far harsher than the crime that didnt cause an accident and was poorly marked so the driver had no idea that they were actually doing anything wrong. Its just like the street that has one sign on a block away showing permit parking, when you get that ticket its not fair and its a pretty harsh penalty. This isnt the city I want to live in.

  • Totally understandable, but rules are rules. Laws are laws. If you don't like it, move to another city. They are ALL doing it. Not uncommon

  • good Lord to you as well, Mike, but you can't have it both ways....

  • Lauri B, you know what I ment in my first post. Your being pretty petty over your misunderstanding of a statement . Kinda silly

  • Thanks for clearing it all up, Mike

  • Bill W. 12 Year Resident of Rogers Park

    You are right, rules are rules and a cop should be enforcing that rule, not a camera and a private company.

  • Bill W. Thanks. I am sure you also read the today's Tribune article on the sweet heart deals our current and former "public servants" cut for themselves on their pensions.
    These are the same people who are going to reform everyone else's State pension.
    One thing this State and City does have in abundance is "World Class Hypocrites" in elected offices.
    Also a thank you for all of your efforts, Mr. Patrick Fitzgerald Esq. you will be missed!

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